[jdgremsjr]

FrannDzs, on 25 April 2022 - 09:51 AM, said:

Sorry to read that and yes I saw something on the forum, but I didn't know the dimension, in the end for arguing about copyrights it was all over. Is it fair? You should put the rancor aside and get back to talking about it. I know copyright is important but personally I don't care if someone else can improve my work. I'm generally open source minded.
Is it fair to terminate Route Riter for that reason? And I don't disrespect the rights of the people who suffered this from Jeffrey, or anyone else I have no drama with any of them I just want this to go forward and nothing else. Forget about the old days, we are grown up people, some of us are quite adult.

Franco Paladini

I'm not saying that Route Riter should not be updated, I think it should, it is a very useful tool. I just didn't want you to get in trouble or have problems. I hope you can get the permission, and get it updated and keep it a usable tool. I know, I would use your version if the proper permissions were obtained.

[edwardk]

I hope you can get the complete code. Besides, do you know what version code you have now? Hopefully he still has the code. He is in his 80's and if he moved around quite a bit since the last time he did any programming, it may be possible that the code was lost.

[eric from trainsim]

FrannDzs, on 25 April 2022 - 09:51 AM, said:

You should put the rancor aside and get back to talking about it. I know copyright is important but personally I don't care if someone else can improve my work. I'm generally open source minded.
Is it fair to terminate Route Riter for that reason? And I don't disrespect the rights of the people who suffered this from Jeffrey, or anyone else I have no drama with any of them I just want this to go forward and nothing else. Forget about the old days, we are grown up people, some of us are quite adult.

Adults don't shut down other people's websites. Jeffrey did it to Elvas and he did it to me.

Adults don't steal from others. He engaged in fraudulent purchases and then initiated chargebacks with several payware suppliers. Chargebacks cost the suppliers money on top of the lost revenue.

Mike signed away the rights to Jeffrey who had intent to be selling an updated version. It didn't work out because he no longer had a customer base interested in doing business with him after those actions.

I doubt anyone here is interested in having anything to do with the man ever again.

Personally, it's not important to me if we have the source code to Route Riter -- it still runs fine under Windows 11 if you know how to set it up.

If it's important to you to have the source, feel free to seek out Jeffrey and ask him to release it.

[FrannDzs]

jdgremsjr, on 25 April 2022 - 12:01 PM, said:

I'm not saying that Route Riter should not be updated, I think it should, it is a very useful tool. I just didn't want you to get in trouble or have problems. I hope you can get the permission, and get it updated and keep it a usable tool. I know, I would use your version if the proper permissions were obtained.

Yes, I respect people, the least I want are problems, on the contrary, I try to make everything friendly and cooperative. That is the key to progress. We should consider being more open.
What I would like the most is that the Open Rails team can take advantage of this, include it as official tools. That would be a good project and we would all give credit to its original creators. I don't say no to that.
I'm looking forward to this with all my might, it's what I'm looking forward to most these days besides other things, but this has me crazy.
For me RR is an extremely useful tool. Between all of us we would make it amazing in honor of Mike Simpson. What he did is incredible and I admire him a lot.

Franco Paladini

[FrannDzs]

edwardk, on 25 April 2022 - 01:19 PM, said:

I hope you can get the complete code. Besides, do you know what version code you have now? Hopefully he still has the code. He is in his 80's and if he moved around quite a bit since the last time he did any programming, it may be possible that the code was lost.

It's Jeffrey's latest version, but he didn't release it completely, I don't know why. I also wish that we "get" the code and I say get because I don't want it for myself as Jeffrey did, I want it to be for the whole community.
I also thought it may have been lost, I doubt it because a good programmer would have the projects in a cloud or backed up somewhere, but anything can happen. Let's pray to God.

Franco Paladini

Admin Comment: You are new to Elvas Tower and may not realize that there are two areas of human activity we do not venture into on the forum...Politics and Religion. Your beliefs are your own, one members idea of "praying to God" may not necessarily align with another members idea...best to leave any Deities out of the discussion altogether.
R H Steele

[FrannDzs]

eolesen, on 25 April 2022 - 01:25 PM, said:

Adults don't shut down other people's websites. Jeffrey did it to Elvas and he did it to me.

Adults don't steal from others. He engaged in fraudulent purchases and then initiated chargebacks with several payware suppliers. Chargebacks cost the suppliers money on top of the lost revenue.

Mike signed away the rights to Jeffrey who had intent to be selling an updated version. It didn't work out because he no longer had a customer base interested in doing business with him after those actions.

I doubt anyone here is interested in having anything to do with the man ever again.

Personally, it's not important to me if we have the source code to Route Riter -- it still runs fine under Windows 11 if you know how to set it up.

If it's important to you to have the source, feel free to seek out Jeffrey and ask him to release it.

I know, but I didn't know that much and I condemn Jeffrey's attitude, it's unbelievable how a person can behave that way at such an age, and maybe in those days he was having a bad time and took it out on the community, because he doesn't need money.
I still don't understand people's motives, why act like that and generate bad vibes around you when you can do your best to make everything flow positively?

What does it mean to give in? Did he sell the project or did he hand it over? Still Mike can have control over it, anyway he created it.

I also agree with what you say, no one wants anything to do with him. the good vibes are gone.

For me it is important since he has no replacement. And now he is in a "bad state" but imagine where we could take him.

I tried to contact Jeffrey but I can't find a valid e-mail, or I don't know if he didn't see the mail, or didn't answer it. I also sent him a message on FB, but he still didn't read it, I think because of the privacy policy.

Franco Paladini

[edwardk]

FrannDzs, on 25 April 2022 - 01:35 PM, said:

It's Jeffrey's latest version, but he didn't release it completely, I don't know why. I also wish that we "get" the code and I say get because I don't want it for myself as Jeffrey did, I want it to be for the whole community.
I also thought it may have been lost, I doubt it because a good programmer would have the projects in a cloud or backed up somewhere, but anything can happen. Let's pray to God.

Franco Paladini

If this is Jeffrey's code, was this downloaded from his site? I would try, if possible to get the source from Mike Simpson. I heard sometime ago that there were issues from Jeffrey's release.

[FrannDzs]

edwardk, on 25 April 2022 - 05:12 PM, said:

If this is Jeffrey's code, was this downloaded from his site? I would try, if possible to get the source from Mike Simpson. I heard sometime ago that there were issues from Jeffrey's release.

Yes, you get the "sources" folder in the installation directory.

Mike told me that he looked for the source code and couldn't find it, since he changed pc 3 times. He looked in backups, pendrive, hard disks, but without success. He told me he will keep looking in some dvd's he had. I hope he finds them.

Franco Paladini

[Genma Saotome]

< ADMIN COMMENT >

Needless to say any conversation that centers upon Voldemort is, for me, automatically a sensitive topic. That it includes copyright issues compounds that.

People who know me already know I hold very strongly negative opinions about current Copyright Law, specifically the obscenely long years of protection; That said, Copyright properly administered by law is a very good thing and I fully endorse the principles of it.

It has always been problematic in our community... arguments, poor understanding of what qualifies, often confusing Trademark and Copyright (very different things), and of course the HUGE expense of calling upon a lawyer to help.

With all of the above in mind, my approach on this site is congruent to the law, but very simple: Don't screw over your peers. Give them the respect that's due to them, and expect the same in return.

Which brings me to this specific matter; I do not regard Voldemort as a peer so I really don't care what happens to the code discussed in this thread. But I know the kind of problems Voldemort has caused in the past and is capable of casing in the future. With that in mind it is clear to me that the the interest of the board, on behalf of it's members, is to not endorse it -- meaning not to touch this stuff with a 10 foot poll.

I therefore request this thread ends and the topic it raises is off limits until such time Mike Simpson finds his code and turns it over to someone trustworthy. If you feel compelled to make a final comment, go ahead, but you get just one. No final comment should be in any way understood as trying to continue the discussion but feel free to state your own bottom line about this topic. Last, please, NO REPLIES to any final comment. Final means terminal, not flickering embers inviting interaction.

Thank you for your understanding of this matter.

< ADMIN EDIT >
I'm satisfied that Mike Simpson has provided his source code and so the thread can remain open.

[FrannDzs]

Well, after so much searching, asking and waiting, the complete source code is released under GPLv3 license in GitHub for study and development.

Mike had already given me permission as he is no longer interested in simulators. And J just said a couple of days ago that he is releasing Route Riter under "Open Rails" GPLv3 license on his blog.

Source Code

Instructions soon.

There are 2 branches, Mike's original version and the other branch updated in 2015

The repository is a bit dirty, i.e. it has irrelevant files. If you are interested in tidying it up, go ahead.

Feel free to contribute.

Fran