[cacciuccofs]

Hi!I'm Luca and I've some problems with steam engines in OR.I've an Asus F552C with Win 8 and an INVIDIA Geforce 710 videocard.I installed MSTS of some nations (Italy,USA,Germany and France)on my C HD and on HDD and I've no working and no graphic problems.I installed OR with newest updates and all right for the engines apart some steam ones (Italian ones in particular).I use automatic fireman.
So problems are when I try to start with steam trains:boiler and steam pressure are very high and water drop from 8.0 to 0.0 in few seconds from depart stopping the trains.
Which can be the problems? Maybe in file ENG settings?I post you some example.Please help me! Thank you!

This post has been edited by cacciuccofs: 19 May 2014 - 12:20 PM

[copperpen]

Hello and welcome to Elvas Tower. What filename is that engine please?. I would like to take a look at the eng file.

[Lindsayts]

My experience after much playing around with eng files is that a lot of steamers in MSTS are very poorly set up. OR complicates the matter by requireing some parameters that either MSTS did not have or did not support.

I believe there is a list of parameters OR requires, my experience is the closer these values are to the particular machines specs the closer the performance will be.

A real difficulty here is that there is very little good performance data for steamers particularly on power output. Steamers usually being able to put out much greater power than most people expected.

Lindsay

[atsf37l]

There is a line in the .eng file called EngineVariables. MSTS reads this for AI and helper engines - any engine not being driven.

EngineVariables( 950 280 1142 160 25000 11180 100 1 0.7 ) - Found near the bottom of the engine file.

These numbers specify fire temp, fire mass, water mass, boiler pressure, tender_water mass, tender coal mass, fire condition and coal quality, in that order. The original default MSTS .eng files put in a tenth quality, "Smoke Quality" and it was normally set to zero.

The MSTS team at Microsoft decided later to only use 9 variables, dropping smoke quality. The problem is that the zero was between boiler pressure and tender water mass and they didn't change the default templates and many engine files got build with 10 variables. In MSTS when you use Bin to switch to a helper engine or AI engine if the tenth variable is in the line you will immediately be out of water and as soon as your engine's boiler needs some - game over! If I'm not mistaken, OR also reads these lines even for the driven engine and you get the same result.

So if your EngineVariables line looks like this:

EngineVariables( 950 280 1142 160 0 25000 11180 100 1 0.7 )

Then get that zero out of there. :lol2:

[captain_bazza]

Hi Luca, thanks for reporting this problem, I have ''pinned'' the topic because the fix given by Herb may help others.

Also, welcome to the ET community.

Topic pinned for future reference....

Cheers Bazza.

[Lindsayts]

 captain_bazza, on 19 May 2014 - 07:34 PM, said:

Hi Luca, thanks for reporting this problem, I have ''pinned'' the topic because the fix given by Herb may help others.

Also, welcome to the ET community.

Topic pinned for future reference....

Cheers Bazza.

Unfortunately there's an good number of reasons on why steamers do not work. A common reason being parameters specified incorrectly a classic example of the is incorrect Boiler Volume. This being incorrect (mostly) or not specified.
A problem here is the lack of knowledge on how the machine really performed leading to values such as Maximum steam production being way out.
I have redone the eng files for dozens of machines mostly to give realistic performance but occasionaly (for around at least 6 machines) getting them to work at all.

The current steam code is a good step forward as it will at least have a guess at a parameters value if it is not specified.

Lindsay

[copperpen]

OR does not use the MSTS engine variables line, it uses the boiler, cylinder, and a few other data lines from the MSTS eng file for both player and AI engines. An unaltered MSTS eng file will work in OR, but the end result does depend on the various data items being correct in the first place. Running out of steam as the OP has done indicates that there are problems within the eng file which need to be fixed.

In auto fireman mode, MSTS will never run out of steam, but OR can if either the usage figures or the generation figures are not right.

[Lindsayts]

For the problem of running out of steam, check the boiler volume, this is usually way to small. A good figure to start with is between 10 to 12 times the grate area. So for a loco with a 70 sq ft grate a boiler volume of 700 to 800 cubic ft works OK. This figure being to small is a common error. A model that does suffer from this is the UP 4000 class big boy.

THe 10 to 12 times factor came about from analysing drawings of locomotive boilers. 4 boilers were done ranging from a 90 ton Heisler to a 500 ton bigboy. The volume of all boilers was worked out from measurements taken from the boilers drawings to get the ratio, the volume figure I use here is the TOTAL volume of the boilers internal space.

Lindsay

[markus_GE]

 copperpen, on 20 May 2014 - 12:40 AM, said:

[...]

In auto fireman mode, MSTS will never run out of steam, [...]

Sorry to say you´re wrong, but I have stalled more than once driving steamers on the relatively flat (opposed to Cajon or Donner Passes) ATSF Needles Sub dur to low steam pressure. And that with a Mountain-type loco and 20 cars (and maybe poor valve-control handling, but that alone can´t be the cause).

Cheers, Markus

[cacciuccofs]

Thanks guys for you answers!If I understood I must change EngineVarible values,right? The original EV in eng file of the steam loco fof the screen (RM 1322) is:

EngineVariables( 770 1045 3388 199.16 13000 4500 350 1 1 )Which values can I change?I post you the RM 1322 eng file.

Thank you everybody!!

See you! Luca