[B & O GUY]

What ever happened to the automatic fireman for steam locomotives in OR? I'm getting to old to try and keep up the water gauge water height and ideal fire mass while trying to take that award winning screen shot at the same time. :lol2:

Seriously though. I can't find where to turn him on in any of the latest releases.

In OR tonight.

I tried running one of Derek Miller's 2-8-8-2's from Oroville to Keddie tonight and had to stop 6 times to fill the boiler with water and fire. Each time the gauge was run down to .1 to .3 inches showing and each time I sat and waited for it to refill while punching the I and O_K AND L keys to run the injectors. I also ran the injectors while running but they could not keep up. The fire mass also could not keep up even while using the R key, but, the steam pressure never dropped appreciably. Then while only a few short miles from Keddie it pops up with a message that the freeze plugs had failed due to low water level of 5.8 inches. Why didn't they fail at .1 to .3 inches.

Anyway. The old automatic fireman would never have let this happen. He was hard working and infallible. He could keep the water up as well as keep the max fire going no mater how impossible it would be for some of our steam locomotives. :lol2:

I don't spend much time in the cab and prefer to roam around with the 2, 3, 4, 5 and 8 keys. For me and maybe some others OR is the basis for all our many model railroads. I like to look at the trains and all those details that hard working modelers put into their models, scenery, textures and scenery objects. This train simulator you folks have created makes our models, textures and scenery look so fantastic that going back to MSTS is no longer an option.

You folks are doing a great job making this simulator extra special. :good2: :)

But! Could we have the automatic fireman back? Is he missing or am I missing him? Please help.

Thanks
Allen

[Lindsayts]

Walter Conklin, on 14 February 2014 - 07:45 AM, said:

Hello,

I support giving OR users the option to run steam locomotives either with or without an Automatic Fireman enabled, as is the case with MSTS.

I completely agree, In real life one simply has not got the time to drive and fire a steam loco at the same time (Note 1). As far as I am concerned in a trainsim its the same. Firing is to much of a distraction and its certain one will miss something.

Another point an AI steamer ____HAS_____ to have a good auto fireman.

Note 1: It has been done when shunting in Australia when demands on the loco was small, almost always though in an out way location where there was little to no chance of management showing up.

Lindsay

[Lindsayts]

On this issue (using an AI or auto fireman) I have repeatedly been accused of "not playing the game". In the end most of us will use a train sim as a real simulator one ____MUST____ be able to treat it as real and therefore be able to choose to use or not to use an AI fireman.

LIndsay

[steamer_ctn]

Hi Allen,

B & O GUY, on 13 February 2014 - 09:17 PM, said:

What ever happened to the automatic fireman for steam locomotives in OR? I'm getting to old to try and keep up the water gauge water height and ideal fire mass while trying to take that award winning screen shot at the same time. :thumbdown3:

The AI fireman is still present. OR usually starts with the AI fireman, and you have to turn it off to go to manual firing.

B & O GUY, on 13 February 2014 - 09:17 PM, said:

I tried running one of Derek Miller's 2-8-8-2's from Oroville to Keddie tonight and had to stop 6 times to fill the boiler with water and fire. Each time the gauge was run down to .1 to .3 inches showing and each time I sat and waited for it to refill while punching the I and O_K AND L keys to run the injectors. I also ran the injectors while running but they could not keep up. The fire mass also could not keep up even while using the R key, but, the steam pressure never dropped appreciably. Then while only a few short miles from Keddie it pops up with a message that the freeze plugs had failed due to low water level of 5.8 inches. Why didn't they fail at .1 to .3 inches.

Unless you have switched to manual firing the manual firing keys, such as the R key will not work.

B & O GUY, on 13 February 2014 - 09:17 PM, said:

Anyway. The old automatic fireman would never have let this happen. He was hard working and infallible. He could keep the water up as well as keep the max fire going no mater how impossible it would be for some of our steam locomotives. :)

The old fireman didn't use any water at all so he was quite a miracle worker.

If it is an articulated, or double locomotive, then I am not sure how OR will cope with it.

B & O GUY, on 13 February 2014 - 09:17 PM, said:

But! Could we have the automatic fireman back? Is he missing or am I missing him? Please help.

Can you please send me the ENG file to look at? Or a link to where I can find the locomotive.

Thanks

Peter

[copperpen]

If there are no ORTS specific parameters in the eng file OR has to make some calculations based on the existing MSTS parameters. One of those is the injector size which if too small will allow the boiler to run out of water if the engine is being worked hard for a long time. The Automatic fireman is working and can cope with the fuel demands and will work up to a specified maximum in the eng file. If the requirement is higher than this then adjust that in the eng file to allow higher firing rates. If you take a look at the Steam Locomotive pdf which is found in the Open rails documents folder you will find a list of OR specific parameters which can be added to the eng file. With correct data in these fields there should be no problems.

[copperpen]

steamer_ctn, on 14 February 2014 - 01:09 PM, said:

If it is an articulated, or double locomotive, then I am not sure how OR will cope with it.

OR is handling articulated the same as MSTS, lead unit drivable, trail unit AI, each with its own boiler water and fuel supply although MSTS AI never used fuel or water.

[copperpen]

Peter

I have the WP 2-6-6-2s running and I suspect the 2-8-8-2s have the same problem, the injectors are not big enough to cope with the demand. I don't understand why this is, because the MN which is a smaller engine has larger injectors allocated by the OR code. The 2-6-6-2 can use 71000 lb/hr through the cylinders, but the injectors are only adding 5060gph maximum.

[steamer_ctn]

Currently the OR code will select up to a maximum of 13mm injector.

In theory, this size injector can fill the boiler at a rate of 85 gal (uk) / min @ 250 psi.

This means that one injector can pump 85 * 60 * 10 (lbs/gal) = 51,000 lb/h of water into the boiler, so in principle two injectors should be capable of 102,000 lb/h. Therefore provided steam usage is not greater then this value, it should cope.

Based on your feedback, perhaps there is a bug in the injector selection mechanism for the locomotive in question.

I would need to see the ENG file before I can make a call on possible problems.

Thanks

Peter

[B & O GUY]

Quote

the OR code will select up to a maximum of 13mm injector.

In theory, this size injector can fill the boiler at a rate of 85 gal (uk) / min @ 250 psi.

This means that one injector can pump 85 * 60 * 10 (lbs/gal) = 51,000 lb/h of water into the boiler, so in principle two injectors should be capable of 102,000 lb/h. Therefore provided steam usage is not greater then this value, it should cope.

Based on your feedback, perhaps there is a bug in the injector selection mechanism for the locomotive in question.

I would need to see the ENG file before I can make a call on possible problems.

Thanks

Peter

Peter

Thanks to you and everyone else here for your response.

Here is the link to the model I was using last night. It's one of Derek Miller's masterpieces.
( http://www.elvastowe...-and-crew-cars/ )

The particular locomotive I used is part of a large set of several of the same type 2-8-8-2's and may all use a similar engine file. The number 260 is the locomotive I used. It's a handsome beast and a lot of fun to both run and view. They also have a unique sound setup by his use of different wheel diameters between the front and rear locomotive sets. They sound real good.

When I was going through the engine files last night, I'm pretty sure that both injectors were 11 mm. Would a 2 mm increase do that much? I was able to run about 10 or 11 miles before running out of water

It's good to hear that Auto Matic is still firing our locomotives. He's always done a fine job.

Hope I've given you enough information to help Auto out with his job. B)

Allen

[B & O GUY]

Peter

Another note. I didn't disable the automatic fireman in MSTS. So that means I did a lot of key punching for nothing.

I just assumed that there was no automatic fireman working in OR and for this reason the key punching was thought to be necessary. OR pops up with a message that says something like this. "Your fireman needs to work the injectors before you run out of water". Or "Your fireman needs to shovel a little more coal. Your fire mass is getting low". That's not exactly what was coming up in the messages as I didn't write them down at the time. But wouldn't you assume that the automatic fireman wasn't working when seeing this.

Thanks

Allen