[Icik]

Yes, it is also present without your patch. This also applies if the AI train is flipped so it lifts the pantographs in reverse order.

[Csantucci]

The tentative bug fix for the flipped locomotives is now present in OR NewYear MG rev. 74. If no issues arise, it will be passed also to the Unstable release.

Changing pantographs at reversal points to AI trains is a bit more complicated. First of all, that shouldn't occur at every reversal point, but only at reversal points followed by a long subpath. If a locomotive is shunting, it does not swap pantos everytime it changes direction. Second, it is not a simple swap, because in general first the new panto is risen and then, only when it is under tension, the old panto is lowered. So there is a bit of a sequence, which moreover should occur at zero speed. However in general AI train paths don't have waiting points at reversal points, and so they stop and immediately restart in the opposite direction. So it's better to have a bit of discussion about this before changing things.

[Icik]

What you wrote sounds reasonable. With a quick turn, the driver is not enough to change to the second cab and therefore could leave with the pantograph already activated. But if a waiting point is defined, it could mean a change of driver's station and therefore a change of pantograph. I have no idea if this is feasible in this way. Anyway, thanks Carlo for the fix.

[Weter]

I can add, that E-locos, especialy under DC-katenary(as amperage is many times grater there, in compare with high-voltage AC-systems), when standing with all auxilary power turned on, during preparing to start (e.g. at station track, waiting for departure approval, or in front of red signal, not yet opened for it), and moreover mooving slow with high loaded motors, during start, shunting, or working uphill, HAVE to rise all of pantos available (2 or 4) <It has to be noted, that I don't mean specialized pantos at multi-system locos> to prevent contact wire from melting at points of contact with its panto's "skies" - so the current-density is lowered, being divided between all of pantos.
When reasonable speed is gained, the FRONT panto have to be lowered, for reserving purpose. (if the rear one will be ocassionaly broken by any obstacle, situated around the wire during journey, its particles will stay behind, and the front panto(s) will stay intact and ready for back-up destroyed rear panto and loko will have an opportunity to move and, likely, to reach the next station, without nessesary of calling helper(s))

So, the shunting-like shuttle-movement is another condition looks like one mentioned above. All available for this type of current pantos have to keep rised.

[markus_GE]

Weter, on 31 August 2020 - 05:05 PM, said:

I can add, that E-locos, especialy under DC-katenary(as amperage is many times grater there, in compare with high-voltage AC-systems), when standing with all auxilary power turned on, during preparing to start (e.g. at station track, waiting for departure approval, or in front of red signal, not yet opened for it), and moreover mooving slow with high loaded motors, during start, shunting, or working uphill, HAVE to rise all of pantos available (2 or 4) <It has to be noted, that I don't mean specialized pantos at multi-system locos> to prevent contact wire from melting at points of contact with its panto's "skies" - so the current-density is lowered, being divided between all of pantos.
When reasonable speed is gained, the FRONT panto have to be lowered, for reserving purpose. (if the rear one will be ocassionaly broken by any obstacle, situated around the wire during journey, its particles will stay behind, and the front panto(s) will stay intact and ready for back-up destroyed rear panto and loko will have an opportunity to move and, likely, to reach the next station, without nessesary of calling helper(s))

[...]

This post was an interesting read even for me, who has no idea about the actual topic of this dicussion. Still, a lot of real-life info that I didn't know before and explanations to things I have long been wondering about. http://www.elvastower.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/sign_thank_you.gif for the insights!
Cheers, Markus

[Csantucci]

Bug fix also available in Unstable release U2020.09.07-1551.

[Weter]

Well, Markus, I'm shure, it's important to understand, "WHY?" when someone wants to do something successfully and not only by instinct.

[QJ-6811]

With "problems" between panto-1 and 2 I read everything above again, but I lost track ..........

I notice that with "CAB-1" (forward) Key: P = Panto-1 and Key: Shift-P = Panto-2. [OK].
When I change cabs (CTR-E) and use "CAB-2" (IOW CAB_RV), it appears that at Key: P the Panto-2 is activated and Key: Shift-P Panto-1 ????
This is considered 'logical' as it is now resolved, but why?

IOW, if you want to use Panto-1 for 15KV and Panto-2 for 25KV, for example, this will go wrong in CAB-2 (CAB_RV)

Or is there a way to - in my view logically - always activate Panto-1 for Key: P and ALWAYS activate Panto-2 for Key: Shift-P?

(maybe another notation in the. S file?)

[Csantucci]

It is logical in most of the cases, where the two pantos are used for the same voltage, and where with P you activate the panto at the opposite part of the loco with respect of the cabin where you are in. In the special cases like yours, you could try using Panto3 or Panto4 as name for your second panto.

[QJ-6811]

Csantucci, on 21 November 2020 - 07:51 AM, said:

It is logical in most of the cases, where the two pantos are used for the same voltage, and where with P you activate the panto at the opposite part of the loco with respect of the cabin where you are in. In the special cases like yours, you could try using Panto3 or Panto4 as name for your second panto.

OK, if this is the definition then "it works as intended". Of course I can also use Panto-3 or 4, but according to the above, you also have the change here, if the overview of March 16 is correct?

>>>>>>>
Front Cab:
P key - Pantograph 1, Animation 1
Shift + P key - Pantograph 2, Animation 2
Ctrl + P key - Pantograph 3, Animation 3
Shift + Ctrl + P - Pantograph 4, Animation 4

Rear Cab:
P key - Pantograph 1, Animation 2
Shift + P key - Pantograph 2, Animation 1
Ctrl + P key - Pantograph 3, Animation 4
Shift + Ctrl + P - Pantograph 4, Animation 3
<<<<<<

It should be noted that the sounds are not (always) correct anymore with many locomotives, after all, P key = Panto-1 = Discrete trigger 45-46. With "CAB-2" this Panto-2 is no longer a response from Discrete trigger 45-46 ....... (I know, resolvable with discrete triggers 66-67, etc, but many models will not produce sound because this was not made at the time)

The CAB-Control / display definitions must therefore also be made different for CAB-1 and CAB-2, i.e. exchange between Panto 1 and 2, and Panto 3 and 4 ............
(Especially with multi-voltage locomotives)

All this doesn't make it that simple, could have been so simple ... :sweatingbullets: (that's why I don't understand the logic)