[Traindude]

One thing I like about ORTS is that unlike MSTS, you can hear external sounds (to some degree) in interior views (cab or passenger). Although this can be set in the "Audio" tab in the options menu under "% external sound heard internally", it applies that value to all rolling stock equally.

In the real world, some rolling stock, particularly passenger equipment, often have soundproofing insulation material applied to their walls to attenuate external sounds to a certain degree, which varies depending on the vehicle (more windows means less soundproofing). Some modern locomotive cabs (such as EMD's SD75I and other locomotives that use EMD's "whisper cab" design) also have sound-insulated walls. Additionally, some rolling stock or locomotives have dampening devices in their suspension and/or bogie/truck systems to attenuate wheel and track noise.

So having a way to set the internal sound (and track sound) attenuation levels to different values for each vehicle would be nice. Who else agrees?

[Weter]

You are right.
OTOH, we have open carriages for excursion rides, for instance, where 100% of external sound is expected to be audible in passenger view.

[Laci1959]

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So having a way to set the internal sound (and track sound) attenuation levels to different values for each vehicle would be nice. Who else agrees?

Hello.

After all, that's what the different sms files are for. A locomotive has two sounds, one is the external sound and the other is the internal sound. The following names usually occur:
vehicle name_Eng.sms >> internal sound, equivalent to vehicle name_cab.sms
vehicle name_Wag.sms >> external sound,
vehicle name_In.sms >> cabin sound,
The part after the _ character indicates which section of the eng file it belongs to.
The situation is different with cars. There, the default sound is the external sound, i.e. vehicle name_wag.sms. But in the Inside ( ) block you can place the passenger voice, i.e. the vehicle name_In.sms file. The appropriate sounds can be placed in each SMS file and the volume can also be adjusted. Even sound by sound.
This worked great back in the MSTS days.

	Inside (
		PassengerCabinFile ( "flirtbelter.s" )
		PassengerCabinHeadPos ( -1.102m 2.6m 6.622m )
		RotationLimit ( 100 100 0 )
		StartDirection ( 0 180 0 )
		Sound ( 5341_In.sms )
	)
	Sound ( 5341_Wag.sms )

The code snippet above shows the solution for using external and internal sound.

Sincerely, Laci 1959

[Weter]

Quote

Even sound by sound.

Is that about "flat" volume curves for each of streams?

Quote

The part after the _ character indicates which section of the eng file it belongs to.

So, tnstead of usual *_cab.sms/*_eng.sms, You offer to indicate, the section of *eng-file, where given *sms should be mentioned (as *.eng-file has only wagon() and engine section, plus (optionally) inside() block, but not cabin() or so section?

Wagon (
***
	Inside (
		PassengerCabinFile ( "flirtbelter.s" )
		PassengerCabinHeadPos ( -1.102m 2.6m 6.622m )
		RotationLimit ( 100 100 0 )
		StartDirection ( 0 180 0 )
		Sound ( 5341_In.sms )
	)
	Sound ( 5341_Wag.sms ) Comment (external sounds)
)
***
Engine (
***
	Sound ( 5341_Eng.sms ) Comment (cabine sounds)
***
)
**

That is progressive and controllable way to define different sound sets, BUT
IT DOES DEMAND a great amount of work for making additional *.sms-files, where there were only one/two.
The approach, offered by Sanjay (am I right with name?) is an attempt for automatized adaptation of existing file sets for ORTS extended capabilities, giving instant and quite satisfactory result to users, until modelers would rework sound sets(what may take years to do).

Also, changing the meaning of _eng suffix would surely mess-up many of us.

[Laci1959]

Weter, on 21 April 2023 - 10:29 PM, said:

Sound by sound....
Is that about "flat" volume curves for each of streams?

Hi Weter.

Not explicitly, but it is. The sounds of a passenger car are either tied to movement, i.e. speed, or static, i.e. they can sound at any time.
The driving sounds are tied to the speed curve you mentioned. But I was thinking of the Volume ( ) value set in the Stream thread. As the following code snippet shows. Although the setting applies to all sounds in the Stream thread, I think this much compromise is acceptable.
Static sounds can be the sound of doors opening, passenger information. Much quieter is the sound of the air flowing into the working cylinders in a separate thread.

Stream (
	Priority ( 6 )
	Volume( 0.25 )
	Triggers ( 2
		Variable_Trigger ( Speed_inc_past 1.0 Startlooprelease ( 1 File ( "../../Kozos_Hangok/b_teloc.wav" -1 ) SelectionMethod ( SequentialSelection ) ) )
		Variable_Trigger ( Speed_dec_past 1.0 ReleaseLoopRelease () )
	)
)

Although the setting applies to all sounds in the Stream thread, I think this much compromise is acceptable.
Static sounds can be the sound of doors opening, passenger information. Much quieter is the sound of the air flowing into the working cylinders in a separate thread.

Of course, there is another solution. At the beginning of the SMS file, it is possible to set in which views the given sound can be heard. According to the code below, external sounds can also be heard in the cars within the distance specified in the Distance ( ) section. If I got into the car and pressed the spacebar, I could hear the locomotive's horn. At least in the MSTS days. Then the OR came and this thing didn't quite work like before. I quickly changed it back and haven't tried it since.

Skip ( ** V43 eng ** )
	ScalabiltyGroup ( 5
		Activation	( ExternalCam ()	PassengerCam ()CabCam ()	Distance ( 250 ) )
		Deactivation	( CabCam ()	Distance ( 250 ) )
		...
	)
	

[Traindude]

Laci1959, on 21 April 2023 - 10:02 PM, said:

Hello.

After all, that's what the different sms files are for. A locomotive has two sounds, one is the external sound and the other is the internal sound. The following names usually occur:
vehicle name_Eng.sms >> internal sound, equivalent to vehicle name_cab.sms
vehicle name_Wag.sms >> external sound,
vehicle name_In.sms >> cabin sound,
The part after the _ character indicates which section of the eng file it belongs to.
The situation is different with cars. There, the default sound is the external sound, i.e. vehicle name_wag.sms. But in the Inside ( ) block you can place the passenger voice, i.e. the vehicle name_In.sms file. The appropriate sounds can be placed in each SMS file and the volume can also be adjusted. Even sound by sound.
This worked great back in the MSTS days.

	Inside (
		PassengerCabinFile ( "flirtbelter.s" )
		PassengerCabinHeadPos ( -1.102m 2.6m 6.622m )
		RotationLimit ( 100 100 0 )
		StartDirection ( 0 180 0 )
		Sound ( 5341_In.sms )
	)
	Sound ( 5341_Wag.sms )

The code snippet above shows the solution for using external and internal sound.

Sincerely, Laci 1959

However doesn't let you, for example, reduce the volume of the track noise (example: mp_rail_low1.wav and usatrack1.sms) heard in a particular vehicle (when in motion) that (in the real world) has dampening devices to reduce the track noise. Currently, the track sound volume plays at the same level for all internal views (cab and passenger) for all rolling stock, whether you want them to or not. If a piece of rolling stock has dampening devices, then we should be able to specify the volume level (example 50%) of the track sounds heard in that vehicle only, while leaving the others unaffected (or with different values).

I'm also talking about how you can hear the sounds of the locomotive or a grade-crossing bell from inside a passenger coach, for example. Next time you play the game, go to passenger view with the train stopped and try to blow the locomotive horn, and you'll see what I'm talking about. How can we reduce the volume of the external sounds (locomotive, scenery, etc) that are heard in internal views (example: passenger view) on a vehicle-by-vehicle basis? For example, one passenger coach couuld have 50% volume of external-view game sounds heard in its passenger view, and another could have only 10% volume of external sounds.

[Weter]

Hello, Laci.
If Volume() parameter is applicable to individual streams too (not only to entire Scalability Group), than its definitely better.

Quote

speed curve you mentioned

I did speak about a volume curve, not speed curve.

Quote

                Activation      ( ExternalCam ()        PassengerCam ()CabCam ()        Distance ( 250 ) )
                Deactivation    ( CabCam ()     Distance ( 250 ) )

I've tried this with my testing diesel locomotive and got nasty sound interference, after some changing views: I guess, the cause is not matching amount of activation/deactivation conditions at the beginning of file's text.

Hello, Traindude.

Quote

reduce the volume of the track noise (example: mp_rail_low1.wav and usatrack1.sms) in a particular vehicle (when in motion)

These are so-called "global" sounds, aren't they?
I know a solution (You'll probably need to use online translator to read that).

Quote

How can we reduce the volume of the external sounds ... in internal views on a vehicle-by-vehicle basis

I'm thinking about introduction of a new modifying (volume proportional factor) parameter for *.eng/*.wag files.

[Traindude]

Here's one solution I propose: Two new passenger view parameters: ORTSPercentTrackSoundVolume and ORTSPercentExternalSoundVolume:

	Inside (
		PassengerCabinFile ( "flirtbelter.s" )
		PassengerCabinHeadPos ( -1.102m 2.6m 6.622m )
		RotationLimit ( 100 100 0 )
		StartDirection ( 0 180 0 )
		Sound ( "5341_In.sms" 
                    ORTSPercentTrackSoundVolume ( 50 )
                    ORTSPercentExternalSoundVolume ( 50 )
                )
	)
	Sound ( 5341_Wag.sms )

ORTSPercentTrackSoundVolume takes the volume of the Global Track SMS files and reduce their overall volume by the amount specified for that passenger view only. Likewise the ORTSPercentExternalSoundVolume parameter takes all the external sounds and reduces their overall volume level by the amount specified in that passenger view only. If on the other hand, the "% external sound heard internally" setting in the Audio options tab is set to any value, that value is overriden by the value specified in the *.wag file's ORTSPercentExternalSoundVolume parameter (again for that vehicle only).

These parameters work the same way when specifying "Cab" SMS files as well.

[Weter]

Nice solution, IMO.
Have added link to post above.

[Laci1959]

As I mentioned, I tried this 14 years ago. It worked in MSTS then. Then the OR came and I reset everything. I haven't dealt with it since then, it just occurred to me as a possibility.
I don't really use track sounds. Since each vehicle has its own beautiful sound, I muted the track sounds. I use the OR Automatic switch and curve squeal track sound. Also, on side lines where the track is not welded, there is a characteristic track sound, but only there.
This is always a topic of discussion in various Facebook groups. Some people insist on the clicking sound because it is so beautiful. Then when I explain that on a track with a speed of 120 km/h, 120-meter-long rails are welded together, and the welding is carefully ground flat, there is great surprise.
If I understand correctly, the Activation ( ), Deactivation ( ), Volume ( ) section does not work for track sounds? Or is it also a matter of setting?