[steamer_ctn]

ATSF3751, on 14 January 2023 - 04:35 PM, said:

As Scott mentioned yes I am a big 4-8-4 guy so of course I would be willing to build a NYC 4-8-4 along with some custom sounds for it as well. I think if Scott, Peter, myself and a few others all work together we could get the Steam Locomotive code narrowed down the way we want it in the Sim. I know Peter needs help with it and its time for us to step up and help him out as he has already gotten us this far with it.

Thanks for the offer, and I would be willing to participate in a group to look at some tweaks that could be done.

ATSF3751, on 14 January 2023 - 04:35 PM, said:

As for testing is concerned I feel we need multiple steam locomotives of different types that are all set up the same way in the coding so we can narrow down what works and what does not so we can figure out what needs more tweaking. We have many fairly good models out there already for both the US and UK steam locomotives that we should be able to use if we set them up properly in the same respect for Open Rails coding.

I was thinking of doing the Flying Scotsman, Mallard and Tornado in the updated Open Rails coding and see how those three locomotives perform in the Sim. The reason I picked these three as they all have good models built of them. All three of them were designed to run at high rates of speed with lighter trains. One more aspect to put into account is they all have three cylinders as well.

While most US steam locomotives were built for power and long distances UK steam locomotives were built for speed and short distances. Of course I would be willing to build a few other steam locomotives as well if needed but lets start with the NYC 4-8-4 first.

In regards to testing and models, my preference is to use models of locomotives for which test reports exist. The test reports will give us an "actual" base to judge locomotive performance against.

Hence lets select models out of the list of test reports shown on this page (or others that people are able to provide). I only like to develop code against clearly defined factual information.

ATSF3751, on 14 January 2023 - 04:35 PM, said:

Going back to boosters one locomotive I do know has one is FRISCO 1522. We already have a model of it for Open Rails thanks to Derek who built it a few years ago so maybe we could use that locomotive to start off. I do believe the booster is on the tender but not 100% sure. I would have to watch some videos of it to figure it out.

I am sure that some of the above locomotives with test reports had boosters fitted.

[scottb613]

Hi Folks,

1522 - has/had a Delta Trailing Truck Booster.

Here's a video of the locomotive at speed.
https://youtu.be/VGhWOBzn1AI


I haven't seen mention of any six axle tenders with a booster.

One thing abundantly obvious from the video - is some wind noise would be an absolute GREAT ADDITION for a steam locomotive at speed - to enhance our immersion. I don't think any train sim has done this.

I'm searching for more booster information - as usual - it's difficult to come by.

Here's a site that may help as the members seem quite knowledgeable - but we'd need some specific questions to ask.

http://www.rypn.org/forums/index.php


Regards,
Scott

[Traindude]

scottb613, on 17 January 2023 - 06:22 AM, said:

I haven't seen mention of any six axle tenders with a booster.

The Pittsburgh & West Virginia 2-6-6-4's come to mind (look at the rear truck). Yes, I know we're a LONG way away from getting into articulated locomotives, but at least it has a 3-axle tender booster truck.

[ATSF3751]

That is why I was saying we could start out with using FRISCO 1522 instead of making a whole new steam locomotive with a booster. I do know that boosters are only good up to a specific speed and then I believe it cuts out. They are only used to get heavy trains started and or keep them going to a specific speed I believe.

A few other steam locomotives I know have boosters are C&O 2-8-4's and 4-8-4, Reading T1 4-8-4, PRR K4, T&) 2-10-4, and a host of other American railroads used boosters as well.

SP 4449 has a very unique booster as well called the Franklin Booster. The Booster sits down in the center of the rear truck, attached to the rear axle. The UP also used them as well and cut out at about 15 to 20 MPH.

Canadian Pacific Railway rostered a grand total of 3257 steam locomotives acquired between 1881 and 1949, yet only 55 were equipped with boosters. 17 H1 class 4-6-4's, 2 K1 class 4-8-4's and all 36 T1 class 2-10-4's.

Here is a little info about Boosters!

https://en.wikipedia.../Booster_engine

https://www.railwayw...ve-booster.html

http://www.douglas-s...ter/booster.htm

https://www.lner.inf...nd/boosters.php

https://ogrforum.oga...soliciting-info

[scottb613]

Hi Folks,

I think Peter wanted two different models to work with - one with a tender booster and one with a trailing truck booster. I don't know of any models with side rods on tenders.

Some good info in those links - the one mentioned that a great deal of steam/water was consumed when the booster was engaged.

Hah - thanks - a triple axle side rod - wow.

Regards,
Scott

[Traindude]

I apologize in advance if I already said this, but I will reiterate that I remember reading in J Parker Lamb's book, Perfecting the American Steam Locomotive, that the Delaware & Hudson had retrofitted their old Camelback 2-8-0's with tender boosters and even did dynamometer car tests to prove it. Here is an article from Railway Age Magazine, with some graphs to show performance. Here is another. These were D&H's class E2 and E3a Engines.

[steamer_ctn]

Traindude, on 18 January 2023 - 12:43 PM, said:

I apologize in advance if I already said this, but I will reiterate that I remember reading in J Parker Lamb's book, Perfecting the American Steam Locomotive, that the Delaware & Hudson had retrofitted their old Camelback 2-8-0's with tender boosters and even did dynamometer car tests to prove it. Here is an article from Railway Age Magazine, with some graphs to show performance. Here is another. These were D&H's class E2 and E3a Engines.

How do you view the books, and what pages is the relevant information on? When I follow the link, it only shows me that it is a Google Book.

[Traindude]

steamer_ctn, on 18 January 2023 - 07:37 PM, said:

How do you view the books, and what pages is the relevant information on? When I follow the link, it only shows me that it is a Google Book.

You need a Google account in order to view them. Log in to your Google or Gmail account and try again.


Or try this link and this link.

[steamer_ctn]

Traindude, on 19 January 2023 - 07:17 PM, said:

Or try this link and this link.

Thanks for that. They look like good reference articles.

Below are a couple of references that I have found as well.

Tractive Effort of Booster.

Test of Booster

Improving Performance with Booster

Operating Tests of a Pacific Booster

If anybody can find any other articles that would still be good, as it is better to have too much info rather then too little.

I think that we have enough information to start to develop a summary of the similarities between the different boosters, and the differences. This will start to define the model that we need to build in the code of OR, as well as the visual models. Who wants to have a go at this (probably in a word document, as it will no doubt change).

scottb613, on 18 January 2023 - 05:10 AM, said:

I think Peter wanted two different models to work with - one with a tender booster and one with a trailing truck booster. I don't know of any models with side rods on tenders.

I think that our research is showing that there are two(?) types of booster unit. It also seems to be showing that it needs to be defined similar to the main steam engine.

My preference in order of priority for selection of models is as follows:

i) Select a CTN model that had a booster fitted.

ii) Select a model which has a test report for it. (See Test Resources on CTN)

iii) Select a model that has enough other reports supporting its operation (such as the articles in the links above).

I am interested to understand what the difference is between a Franklin C1 and C2 booster.

[Traindude]

steamer_ctn, on 19 January 2023 - 10:15 PM, said:

I am interested to understand what the difference is between a Franklin C1 and C2 booster.

There were 3 models of boosters that Franklin made--C, C1 and C2. Each later model superseded the one that came before it. So far, the only differences between the three models, at least from what my resources tell me, are the designs of the parts of the booster control system--reverse lever pilot valve, preliminary throttle, dome pilot valve, main booster throttle, cylinder cock operating mechanisms, etc.