[Traindude]

Hi.

In revisiting (and potentially revising) my proposal for fuel stops in timetable mode, I have a question regarding pools in general. While reading the OR manual, the following paragraph has me puzzled:

Quote

"A pool can only contain trains which are equivalent in usage. The trains need not all be same type, but their use must be exchangeable. It is not possible to select a specific type of train from a pool."

The way I am interpreting this is that (particularly in the case of AI trains), ORTS selects engines from a pool at random (with respect to their position in queue on the respective storage tracks). How does this relate to the consist (assumed to be a light-engine consist) defined in the #consist row at the top of the train columns? This is one critical question that needs to be answered if different kinds of engines are to be stored in a pool. Does ORTS' pool engine-selection algorithm override the consist defined in the #consist row? Or does it wait until the next instance of the specified light-engine consist is next in the pool queue (no pun intended!)?

I'm confused... :wacko: :unknw:

[Traindude]

Weter, on 03 September 2022 - 12:41 AM, said:

Hello.
I have digested all Manual's ch.11 for translation reasons, so I would help, but for now, I can't fully understand the subject of Your complication.
Please tell about things, You are interesting more concrete.
What for pools in general, because ORTS can't make any distinction between pooled trains, it just works according to "stack" principle: last pooled train will be then taken first (for every storage siding). The other case, if there are multiple storage tracks in one pool.
Manual also says, that no shunting operations are possible in pools, so complex train must be uncoupled before pooling, and otherwise - assembled together only after prior extracting all it's parts from pool. Also, cars, which can't move autonomously can't be pooled (they must have at least one "engine" unit to go in and out of pool by themselfes).
What for engines - I think, any of them would be taken, so author of pool definition must assume, that all stored locomotives must be interchangeable.
OTOH, You can define multiple one-track pools, acces to which may match; then, specify each of these tracks for some locomotive type (for instance, if some storage tracks are electrified, but other - no)

I think, ORTS doesn't care, whether given consist would be trainset or light engine: it takes any of them, assuming that in one pool they all are equivalent for given way of usage.

So, a hypothetical situation here:
=====================================================
Let's say a "train" is due to pull out of the pool (assuming the "train" in question is a locomotive departing the pool to, for example, fetch coaches for a passenger train). The *.con file referenced in the #consist row for that train references, say, a steam-locomotive-and-tender combination. This loco-and-tender combo is already present in the pool at the time of the pullout, and is in the front of a queue of waiting engines on one of the pool's storage track. On an adjacent storage track, a diesel is at the front of the queue of engines on that track. At the time of the pullout, ORTS may choose either the "assigned" steam loco or the diesel at random.
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In reference to my earlier proposal for fuel stops in timetable mode, this means that, in regard to the hypothetical scenario just described, in addition to specifying coal and water level values for the "ordinarily assigned" steam locomotive for the train, diesel-fuel levels must also be specified in case ORTS substitutes the diesel on the adjacent track.

Is that sounding right to you?

[Weter]

Hello.
Thanks for clarification, I hope, I now understood You better. So:
First, there was a topic here on ET, about absent diesel fuel consumption during idle (player's locomotive).
I don't know, was it corrected by ORTS devs, or no.
Second, it's a good question: must (and do) diesel locomotives in pool wait with working or stopped engine?
Third, as diesel and steam locomotives are so different either in technical aspect, and, I guess, in real life, there are clear rules about to which of trains and then, each of locomotives would be assigned (doubtful, that there's no difference, or there's a random selection), I tend to think, that would be better idea to assign separate pools (storage tracks in fact) for diesel and steam traction.
This way, the author of timetable definition would deliberately specify, whether from diesel or steam pool, the neded for given train locomotive would be taken.
I tend to think, as well, that in real life, different storage tracks (and even different places) are used for diesel and steam engines pooling: it may be higher fire probability, if many liquid and vaporized diesel fuel, oil and other inflammable liquids would be just next to heated surfaces, open fire, cinders, hot ash, etc.

[roeter]

When an engine (or train, in general) is requested from a pool, the first engine available in the queue is activated an will exit the pool. The consist of this engine is disregarded, there is no check on a match between the consist defined for that particular train in the timetable, and the actual consist of the engine.
The consist definition for a train which exits from a pool is only used when that engine has to be created if the pool is empty.

Regards,
Rob Roeterdink

[Weter]

Hi, Robert!
Happy to "see" You again.
The question, then:
What if our pool contains several parallel storage tracks? Which engine would be taken then? Which of them would be very available?

[Traindude]

roeter, on 04 September 2022 - 11:45 PM, said:

When an engine (or train, in general) is requested from a pool, the first engine available in the queue is activated an will exit the pool. The consist of this engine is disregarded, there is no check on a match between the consist defined for that particular train in the timetable, and the actual consist of the engine.
The consist definition for a train which exits from a pool is only used when that engine has to be created if the pool is empty.

Regards,
Rob Roeterdink

Thanks. So, in terms of my proposal to define fuel levels/stops in timetable mode, then it may be necessary to, for example, specify coal, water AND diesel levels when a pool contains a mix of both steam and diesel locos (assuming ORTS would disregard the coal and water values if it chooses a diesel, and vice versa).

The next issue--if a pool contains a mix of diesel or electric locos, some of which are equipped with boilers used to provide steam heat for passenger trains while others are not, then there needs to be some shunting/switching command for the inclusion of a boiler car within the consist if the loco ORTS chooses from the pool doesn't have a boiler on board.