[Genma Saotome]

Are there Trello cards for any of this?

[scottb613]

Genma Saotome, on 21 November 2022 - 11:21 AM, said:

Are there Trello cards for any of this?

Hi Dave,

I always thought of it more like a bug - I didn't submit one previously - I did just now though - it's on the list.
;)

Regards,
Scott

[steved]

Scott,
I've always thought the sky dome you made last year is great.
https://i.imgur.com/WqBjMyV.jpg
If you wanna make more I can throw some beer money your way to help defer the cost.
Your beer, not mine. http://www.elvastower.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/derisive.gif

Randy

[Genma Saotome]

scottb613, on 22 November 2022 - 02:16 AM, said:

Hi Dave,

I always thought of it more like a bug - I didn't submit one previously - I did just now though - it's on the list.
;)

Regards,
Scott

Ahhh, I was hoping to have a brief discussion of what specifically to ask for before writing the card. For example, should the diameter of the skydome be some ratio of the view distance vs. just way the heck out there? We know the mesh is too small but what should the number of "latitude" mesh lines be in relation to the number of "longitude" mesh lines? Should the skydome texture be moved to the routes \texture folder, including possible placement in the seasonal folders? Stuff like that.

[scottb613]

steved, on 22 November 2022 - 10:09 AM, said:

Scott,
I've always thought the sky dome you made last year is great.
If you wanna make more I can throw some beer money your way to help defer the cost.
Your beer, not mine. http://www.elvastower.com/forums/public/style_emoticons/default/derisive.gif

Randy

Hi Randy,

Beautiful Pix!!!

Thank you for the complement and kind offer. It's not the cash required that's stopping me - it's the distortion. If I am going to expend all this effort - - - and cash - - - it has to be right. For heavy cloud cover - it takes DAYS (> 2) to process the Ray Tracing for a single image and I can't do anything else on my computer during this time - as the process is intense - using 100% of the PC's resources.

Since you're enthusiastic - I saved a few more 10K images - I'll send them your way for review. I found the greater the cloud cover - the more noticeable the distortion. I don't use them.

Regards,
Scott

[scottb613]

Genma Saotome, on 22 November 2022 - 11:20 AM, said:

Ahhh, I was hoping to have a brief discussion of what specifically to ask for before writing the card. For example, should the diameter of the skydome be some ratio of the view distance vs. just way the heck out there? We know the mesh is too small but what should the number of "latitude" mesh lines be in relation to the number of "longitude" mesh lines? Should the skydome texture be moved to the routes \texture folder, including possible placement in the seasonal folders? Stuff like that.

Hi Dave,

Oops.
:byecry:

I did think enough to link to this thread on the Trello Card.

As James Ross previously stated - here - he is the only one who probably has the skills necessary to look at this. Perhaps - if someone has any sway with him - they could ask him if he could take a few minutes and look at this? I don't think we know enough to offer viable solutions. There might be a better way to address this than simply adding poly's to the procedural shape. For example - in 3D modeling software - we have several options on how to "wrap" a texture on an object. "Flat Wrap" which I use 90% of the time - which basically folds like paper around the object. Cylindrical Wrap for cylinders. Finally - "Spherical Wrap" for spheres. If I create a sphere in my modeling software - I can use Spherical Wrap on the same texture I posted here and it will be applied without distortion. Is that available to someone writing code on a procedural shape - I have no idea.

That said - we're not inventing a new method - simply trying to improve on what we have - perhaps it wouldn't take a massive development effort?

All roads lead to James...
;)

Regards,
Scott

[railguy]

On the subject of skydomes and the sky itself--one of my pet peeves is that OR apparently renders the moon in front of the skydome. Thus, if one is using a skydome with cloud textures, the moon renders in front of the clouds, which destroys the effect. I've tried several fixes on my own, but have not achieved success. Is there a way to make the moon semi or fully transparent, so it will appear to be behind the clouds; or a way to simply get rid of it altogether if one doesn't want it to show up when using a cloud-textured skydome? As always, any advice appreciated.

[scottb613]

Hi...


There are two "moon" textures in the "content" directory of ORTS - I bet if you "alpha" them out - the moon would disappear.

Regards,
Scott

[scottb613]

Hi Folks,

Terragen came out with a new sky program that makes it easier to get good results for a novice user. Looks promising.


Terragen Sky
https://youtu.be/joyh-lvaWN0


Regards,
Scott

[James Ross]

scottb613, on 22 November 2022 - 12:15 PM, said:

As James Ross previously stated - here - he is the only one who probably has the skills necessary to look at this. Perhaps - if someone has any sway with him - they could ask him if he could take a few minutes and look at this? I don't think we know enough to offer viable solutions. There might be a better way to address this than simply adding poly's to the procedural shape. For example - in 3D modeling software - we have several options on how to "wrap" a texture on an object. "Flat Wrap" which I use 90% of the time - which basically folds like paper around the object. Cylindrical Wrap for cylinders. Finally - "Spherical Wrap" for spheres. If I create a sphere in my modeling software - I can use Spherical Wrap on the same texture I posted here and it will be applied without distortion. Is that available to someone writing code on a procedural shape - I have no idea.

That said - we're not inventing a new method - simply trying to improve on what we have - perhaps it wouldn't take a massive development effort?

Thanks for everyone investigating and continuing to help improve the sky in Open Rails!

I have spent today investigating and improving the code we have, so here's a recap of the current situation:

• Sky is formed of 3 layers (back to front):
  
  • Cloud-less sky and night sky textures, blended according to time of day, and with sun effect added in (in the shader)
    
  • Moon textures (phase is random currently)
    
  • Clouds blended by overcast factor and animated by wind speed and direction
  
  
• Sky dome is 6000m away (but this doesn't matter since it is fixed to the camera and always drawn behind everything else)
  
• Sky dome is split into 24 segments (sides) around the center
  
• Sky dome is split into 6 segments (steps) from top to horizon and 1 more segment beyond horizon
  
• Moon is 5700m away
  
• Cloud dome is 5400m away

I have not deciphered the algebraic code for the current sky dome vertex or texture positions, but, having rewritten it to be a simple smooth calculation, with 32 sides (up from 24) and 16 steps to the horizon (up from 6) the textures in this thread display quite nicely

However, for Open Rails to generate the variety of skies needed for activities and user randomisation, I believe we need to keep the blue sky and sun separate from the clouds (perhaps not even using a texture for the blue sky)

So can we generate a texture or set of textures for just the clouds that we can use in Open Rails?