[SD45T-2]

ORTS Developers,

Why does the 2 and 3 views center on the front and rear of a car, instead of in the center like the 4 camera does?

This is a poor setup for someone who is used to having the Camera centered on the centered of the car, and is a common complaint with OR.

Can this please be fixed, or at least tell me where the camera code is so I can fix it myself?

[Weter]

Maybe Shift+2(3) can be assigned to toggle camera's focus face to/center?
Centering at face-ends of front/end car is sometimes useful. And You can rotate camera's axle, holding Alt or Mouse-right buttons pressed.

[SD45T-2]

Weter, on 29 August 2020 - 01:54 AM, said:

Centering at face-ends of front/end car is sometimes useful. And You can rotate camera's axle, holding Alt or Mouce-right buttons pressed.

First, Shift+2(3), does not work.

You can maipulate the camera, but that's a pain. It's not something people want to do.

And while it's useful sometimes, there's a lot to be said for conventions. Every other Train-Sim has the external pacing view camera centered on the center of a car/engine, why should OR be different? I know OR is a unique thing altogther, but having the 2 and 3 cameras centered on the front and end of the car seems very arbitrary, with no rhyme or reason why OR is different in this aspect.

If we re-center the 2 and 3 cameras on the center of the car/engine, that will make people more comfortable using Open Rails, because it's how every other train-sim acts.

[Weter]

Quote

First, Shift+2(3), does not work.

Sorry, I wasn't clear: the possible key combination was mentioned (which is not implemented now)
And... of cource, I didn't want to say, that Your proposal is not good.

[vince]

Leave as is.

vince

[SD45T-2]

Vince, could you please explain why should we leave it as it is?

As I mentioned, this decision feels arbitrary, with no rhyme or reason as to why it's this way.

ORTS is the only program that doesn't have pacing views at the center of a car/locomotive.

Trainz has it centered on the center of a car/locomotive.
MSTS had it centered on the center of a car/locomotive.
Railworks has it centered on the center of a car/locomotive.
TSW has it centered on the center of a car/locomotive.
Many vehicle sims have it on the center of the vehicle.

And other sims that don't operate in a First Person view.

[vince]

SD45T-2, on 31 August 2020 - 05:48 PM, said:

Vince, could you please explain why should we leave it as it is?

As I mentioned, this decision feels arbitrary, with no rhyme or reason as to why it's this way.

ORTS is the only program that doesn't have pacing views at the center of a car/locomotive.

The others got it wrong?

[Genma Saotome]

Of course it is arbitrary. That's because w/o a camfig file there can be only one solution and whomever coded it figured their idea was good enough. Unfortunately nobody wanted to bother coding up a camfig file to replace that.

If you search the Developers Ideas for the string "Camera Sets" you will find a proposal to bring the camfig into OR and make it a modern implementation, which is to say up to 10 camera positions for each set. That could mean 4 locomotive tracking cameras that are 2m above the group, another 4 that are 4m up, one way ahead looking back, one well behind (and say 5m high) looking forward. Copy that and specify end of train. That's 2 sets. Copy that and specify f4 type tracking. Get the idea? Anyway, Chris Jakeman started on that but set it aside. Perhaps he'll pick it up again.

[YoRyan]

You can already adjust the pivot point with Shift-Alt-PgDown and Shift-Alt-PgUp keys; Carlo implemented them last year. (Side note: This satisfies this outstanding Trello card.)

But yes, defaulting to the end of the railcar is pretty silly. I can think of no rational reason to do this. So here's a patch to move it back to the center:

diff --git a/Source/RunActivity/Viewer3D/Cameras.cs b/Source/RunActivity/Viewer3D/Cameras.cs
index 8fa3e24ad..78a5987bc 100644
--- a/Source/RunActivity/Viewer3D/Cameras.cs
+++ b/Source/RunActivity/Viewer3D/Cameras.cs
@@ -1066,7 +1066,7 @@ protected override void OnActivate(bool sameCamera)
                 {
                     SetCameraCar(GetCameraCars().First());
                     browsedTraveller = new Traveller(attachedCar.Train.FrontTDBTraveller);
-                    ZDistanceM = 0;
+                    ZDistanceM = -attachedCar.CarLengthM / 2;
                     HighWagonOffsetLimit = 0;
                     LowWagonOffsetLimit = -attachedCar.CarLengthM;
                 }
@@ -1075,7 +1075,7 @@ protected override void OnActivate(bool sameCamera)
                     var trainCars = GetCameraCars();
                     SetCameraCar(trainCars.Last());
                     browsedTraveller = new Traveller(attachedCar.Train.RearTDBTraveller);
-                    ZDistanceM = -attachedCar.Train.Length + (trainCars.First().CarLengthM + trainCars.Last().CarLengthM) * 0.5f;
+                    ZDistanceM = -attachedCar.Train.Length + (trainCars.First().CarLengthM + trainCars.Last().CarLengthM) * 0.5f + attachedCar.CarLengthM / 2;
                     LowWagonOffsetLimit = -attachedCar.Train.Length + trainCars.First().CarLengthM * 0.5f;
                     HighWagonOffsetLimit = LowWagonOffsetLimit + attachedCar.CarLengthM;
                 }
@@ -1237,7 +1237,6 @@ public override void Update(ElapsedTime elapsedTime)
             }
             else if (attachedCar != null)
             {
-                attachedLocation.Z += attachedCar.CarLengthM / 2.0f * (Front ? 1 : -1);
                 LookedAtPosition = new WorldPosition(attachedCar.WorldPosition);
             }
             UpdateLocation(LookedAtPosition);

[YoRyan]

I have filed a Trello card for this change. If management approves, I will file a PR.