[Csantucci]

In view of the hopeful integration of MG in the official OR, multisampling is one of the open issues, because it heavily impacts on frame rate, but also on picture quality.
I made a small test on my quite outdated notebook (see specs in attached logfile)
 OpenRailsLog.zip (3.66K)
Number of downloads: 4
Here the results of my test. In all cases I generated autonomously the builds and run with no Internet connection and with antivirus disabled, to have comparable conditions.
The differences in picture quality can be seen especially on the overheadwire at the right of the image, against and above the houses there (so maybe this wasn't the most critical picture to appreciate differences). Look at the pictures at their full resolution.

Official XNA-based Open Rails, 45 FPS:
 XNA.jpg (355.94K)
Number of downloads: 59

OR MG with multisampling checkbox enabled (should be Multisampling = 32 if the computer supports it), 28 FPS:
 MG_MSMAX.jpg (332.27K)
Number of downloads: 58

OR MG with multisampling checkbox disabled (which in reality means Multisampling = 4), 35 FPS:
 MG_MS4.jpg (332.78K)
Number of downloads: 50

OR MG with no multisampling (specific build generated), 47 FPS:
 MG_NOMS.jpg (348.2K)
Number of downloads: 48

The modified files for the specific OR MG with no multisampling are these ones:
 Runactivity_noMS.zip (829.42K)
Number of downloads: 16
to be replaced within OR NewYear MG rel. 26. To get no multisampling the related checkbox must obviously be unchecked.

Some considerations:
1) my old computer probably isn't the best test bench. Apparently on newer computers with more powerful graphics MG behaves much better in relation to XNA than on my computer.
2) the graphics aspect most similar to XNA is achieved with OR MG and multisampling = 4 (accordingly to my eye)
3) due to the impact of this feature, I'd think that at least in a first phase an option should be available to the players about the multisampling level desired
4) best way to provide that is a slider, from no multisampling to maximum value (that for MG should be 32).

Tests by other people are welcome. Take into account that at the moment you make the screenshot the FPS drop down. So check the FPS before the screenshot. This is the reason why I haven't put the HUD on my pictures. Wait also some seconds until the FPS are stabilized to assess their value.
Take into account also that the downloadable official XNA OR performs faster than the version that I have built locally (mine was generated with the debug switch): the same XNA picture that got 45 FPS with my XNA build got 54 FPS with the official XNA build.

[wacampbell]

Does the XNA version have multisampling enabled? What level?

[Mike B]

What I'm reading between the lines is that XNA does not do multisampling. Correct? Does it do any kind of useful anti-aliasing?

Note: my computers are all old - very old (like 10-15 years). They run Win10 satisfactorily, and "OEM" ORTS (weekly builds using XNA) runs (with most routes) at monitor refresh speed or better in the desktop (Core2 Extreme, GTX 750ti). Laptop is so bad it's not worth mentioning - typically <20 fps, and when it dips to near 10 the game becomes unplayable (gen1 i5 with processor graphics). I have no idea how much debug is active in the weeklies, nor how that might affect operation.

I'm willing to try the tests in the desktop - laptop is a lost cause. Presumably I would need to install Monogame into Windows 10 before installing OR MG - anything else needed? Do I need any particular version of Monogame, or will the latest/current one do?

[Csantucci]

Mike,
you don't need to install Monogame. The Monogame libraries needeed are present in the OR NewYear MG download. Simply download it, unpack it with 7zip somewhere in the computer, and run OpenRails.exe that you find within folder OR_NewYear_MG.

[Eldorado.Railroad]

I will add my thoughts/experience here:

A.) I suggest that what governs your framerates more than anything are the number of primitives you are rendering. So choosing some arbitrary scene without that information displayed in the HUD is not a good idea.

B.) As a complement to A.), the amount of video memory is also crucial. If you are trying to display 1GB worth of data on a 500MB card framerates will be low.

C.) Static frame grabs are not very effective in demonstrating the quality of image being supplied for a given multisampling. It is when the camera is moving that the user will notice what the tradeoffs are. Higher multisampling leads to a smoother image frame to frame at the cost of more GPU muscle.

D.) On this older WinXP machine with a 1GB AMD 5830 (two cards in SLI, and XNA) and super sampling I achieve a solid 60 frames per second, as long as I tailor the routes to fit the capabilities of the hardware. Note that two cards are needed to pull this off, as super sampling with a single card is not possible at 60 frames per second.

E.) I have been using an older version of OR MG (Nov 2018 release) on the Win7 (i7 from 2013) machine with a GTX 1080ti that never really fails to give a solid 60 frames per second regardless of what I run...mostly.

F.) Whatever multi/super sampling capabilities that were in the OR MG version (v2222) I hope will continue to be available in any newer version of OR MG. It is visually very pleasing to look at! Thanks.

G.) I am very conservative with OR MG releases because I am involved with modelling. I pick and choose the version I will run next, because the .fx files are modified to suite my needs.

H.) In general it is best to synchronize the frames per second to the capabilities of your display for Open Rails. There is not much to be gained by trying to render 200 fps on a 60 fps monitor. Unless your electricity bill is of little importance to you!

Thank you for all your very hard work Carlo!

[jtr1962]

Csantucci, on 16 June 2019 - 12:33 AM, said:

3) due to the impact of this feature, I'd think that at least in a first phase an option should be available to the players about the multisampling level desired
4) best way to provide that is a slider, from no multisampling to maximum value (that for MG should be 32).

I agree with this but I think the option should remain available permanently, not just in the first phase. The impact of frame rates due to multisampling was really the only negative I encountered in my testing of OR MG. A slider to let me choose the best frame rate for my machine would be welcome.

[James Ross]

Csantucci, on 16 June 2019 - 12:33 AM, said:

Some considerations:
1) my old computer probably isn't the best test bench. Apparently on newer computers with more powerful graphics MG behaves much better in relation to XNA than on my computer.
2) the graphics aspect most similar to XNA is achieved with OR MG and multisampling = 4 (accordingly to my eye)
3) due to the impact of this feature, I'd think that at least in a first phase an option should be available to the players about the multisampling level desired
4) best way to provide that is a slider, from no multisampling to maximum value (that for MG should be 32).

The interesting thing for me is that the XNA code enables multisampling but does not set a level, and this should result in it using the maximum supported by the graphics card and XNA (16).

I am okay with adding a slider that defaults to 4.

[vassalfada]

Hello everyone,

I have a question about the anti-aliasing in OR MG :

I've been using an old OR MG version that allowed me to apply some excellent Nvidia Inspector anti-aliasing options (from January 2019 if I remember correctly).

The picture was superb and the framerate even better.

At some point last year, the Nvidia Inspector anti-alising stopped to work in OR MG (and I've no idea why), which forced me to apply the normal Nvidia AA from control panel, and the result was far from good, even with maximum AA settings.

Then, I tested all the OR versions available (stable, testing, MG) and none of them will allow the use of NV Inspector.

Of course, I tested the internal OR anti-aliasing, but even with the 32x setting, the picture is still a bit aliased and there's tons of flickering textures on the trains and environments.

Reshade helped me to improve the AA but not much regarding the flickering textures.

This simulator improved greatly during the last years, but it's a shame that we lost the possibility to get a nice picture.


Do you know a way to get a great un-aliased and un-flickering picture with any of the current OR versions?

Or can you please link me to any of the previous OR MG version that supported Nvidia Inspector?

Thank you so much in advance for your answers or advices :)

This post has been edited by vassalfada: 05 April 2021 - 08:52 AM

[Csantucci]

Here http://www.interazio...Year_MG_old.zip you can download a version dated 08/06/2019.

[vassalfada]

Ah, that's great! Thanks, I'll try and see if it works :sign_thanks: